The Beginnings, Now, and Iraq
'When Caliph al-Mansur founded his new capital, Baghdad, in 764, he called in the Jewish astrologer, Jacob Ibn Tariq (who was believed to have obtained star tables from India) to help him set up a school of astronomy. They employed another man, Mashallah, as court astrologer. The Baghdad school became famous. The first major Muslim philosopher, al-Kindi, taught there and followed the Greek example of treating astrology as a branch of the sciences.
Contests of ideas between thinkers who preferred to follow a rationalist path, based on the writings of Aristotle, and their more mystical opponents, taking inspiration from Plato, raged as fruitfully among the Jews as among the Muslims. The majority of Jewish scholars accepted the reality of astrology in greater or lesser degrees. In these first centuries AD, scholars and philosophers continually engaged in the debate over free will and determinism in astrological thinking.'
It's no mistake that complete chaos is descending upon Iraq now as Jupiter transits Sagittarius and Pluto heads toward the Galactic Center.
This area is known as the birthplace of our modern civilization and was once a great center of knowledge, Baghdad one of the most magnificent cultural centers of all time. As the human destruction escalates, so does the communication of understanding that exists in the ancient memories of the Middle East. Of the whole world, really. And visions of the never before are in the mix, as well. Choices are being offered and decisions will be made by the time Pluto leaves Sagittarius in 2008.
This historical debate among astrologers about free will and determinism is once again aroused. It's clear to me that this event is outside of anyone's control. It's not about George Bush, Richard Cheney, and the Neoconservative Movement, and never was. The moment Hussein was deposed it was out of human control. Probably even well before. Societies have dictators for reasons. They can't govern themselves, so they resort to iron-fisted techniques. I think when dictators are overthrown normally, an equally authoritative government replaces them. This case was unique. No one stepped in to quell the pandemonium. Naturally I perceive the influence of a cosmic hand. Who drew whom into whose karma has always been a mystery. I tend to think all are responsible. And I expect the knowledge gained from this transit to eventually emerge from the ashes.
Several lessons are on board.
The United States of America will return home wounded, humiliated, and weakened after the last series of failed military ventures, this being the climax. Very unlikely that she will attack anyone for a long time.
The failure of our three dominant religions, Mohammedanism, Judaism, and Christianity is clear to the world. Killing other humans is prohibited in all of them, and this massacre is revealing the full extent of the hypocrisy and futility of the action. It will continue around the world but I'm sure faith has been shaken fundamentally. No better place than in the birthplace of these failed systems. Yet astrology, entwined with all of them, is alive and well.
The necessity of carving out a personal destiny within an uncontrollable flux of circumstances is paramount. One based on real morals, real ethics, and real acceptance of the possibility of an improved world.
I'm not exactly sure how much determinism is involved in this geopolitical event. I do know that free will to some extent is my choice and I intend to exercise it.
More will be learned when Pluto comes back next summer for the last time to the Galactic Center, turns around, and proceeds to the next phase. The lessons of Baghdad should be revealed and the success that naturally follows failure will be on deck.
The astrological orchestration is a phenomenon to behold.
And, of course, education never stops.
posted by jm at 2:48 AM
90 Comments:
WOW!
this will take re-reading, thinking.
War
who sends our children to Kill?
Dying on the battlefield they cry for their Mothers
that's all i want to say
WOW! is right! A very impressive post, jm. And I'm with tseka when it comes to War . . . will humanity ever become truly humane?!
who sends our children to Kill?
This is THE question.
Great great comments. I would love to explore this.
will humanity ever become truly humane?!
If survival depends on it.
Because of the timing and place of the conflict in Iraq I always thought there was something unique and outstanding about the situation that would bring learning home in a bigger way than usual. With the Pluto finishing its transformation of the religious hierarchy, I think it's starting to come in. I noticed a news item about the Catholic Church today ... should the church change policy?. I would laugh if it weren't so horrible.
I'm pondering the real underlying reasons for the whole history of bloodshed in Iraq.
It's far more powerful than these players now. And maybe this conflict is a culmination. I've neve seen such chaos. Who is the enemy? There is suspense as I watch it unfold and the result is a complete mystery at this point. But something is afoot.
I still would love the answer:
who sends our children to kill?
Another thing I've been looking at is how astrology has been laced with religious philosophy all along. It's not as emotional, possessive, and full of leaders whose character is suspect. it doesn't lead to murder as far as I can ascertain. Yet is is part of the cosmic question, and all cultures in history have consulted the map of the sky.
I'm thinking as we dip into this center of the Milky Way this time around that astrology might be part of the bridge to the metaphysical that remains as the religions diminish. It might assume more importance as time goes on.
I'm pondering the real underlying reasons for the whole history of bloodshed in Iraq.
It's far more powerful than these players now. And maybe this conflict is a culmination. I've neve seen such chaos. Who is the enemy? There is suspense as I watch it unfold and the result is a complete mystery at this point. But something is afoot.
so it would seem...
A place of inquiry for my son and i these past many years, there is much to say and your post is important JM, so i want tell you that today a friend and longtime client died and i am adrift in the sea of salt. i will come later another time and honor your work with a more thoughtful reply.
who sends our children to Kill
Greed a too simple answer. One of some.
Another answer?
A sami shaman poet joik:
~they came from the end of the world
with an abundance of things
did they themselves even understand
what use to make of it
they themselves
a big load already
~expected to be served
day and
night
gave orders
found fault
complained
everything, everything was wrong
if they were by themselves
they were at a loss
within the security of walls
they looked for the bottle
laughed
~they were fine
noble gentlemen
could not sit by the fire
~they knew who they were
knew everything,possessed everything
held themselves above life itself
our grandmothers
followed the signs of the times
taught us
how many months to a year
the guests had one month less
they do not speak the language of nature
.....
.....
they were noble gentlemen
for them their law
was the law of nature
we, their servents
~petrified hearts
do not feel
receive
see
or hear
~happiness
the mind's shining
~beauty
is sinful
that is what they taught
and god
only a zealot
Most interesting, jm!
FWIW, I think it's significant that Mesopotamia, the cradle of civilization is also the scene of so much strife and bloodshed. Seems that the area has been the location of endless rounds of misery, from warring tribes to modern-day guerilla warfare.
Interestingly, I learned that the natives of Palestine do not call it that. They call it Falestine.
Falestine = Philistine.
And wasn't it the Philistines who were said to be constantly warring with the Hebrew tribes over land?
So it's essentially tribal disputes magnified and echoing generation after generation, so that neither side really knows, anymore, why they hate each other. Except that it's about land, as it always is.
Here's an interesting page on the origin of the word Palestine. Let's go!
Wikipedia also has an extensive page on the subject.
~they knew who they were
knew everything,possessed everything
held themselves above life itself
Now doesn't that sound familiar . . . foolishness that results in much pain for others.
so sorry for your loss, dear one. it is never easy but know we hold you close in our hearts. (((((tseka)))))))
So it's essentially tribal disputes magnified and echoing generation after generation, so that neither side really knows, anymore, why they hate each other. Except that it's about land, as it always is.
Will this only end when all are dead?! It's like it's hardwired into their systems now . . . all the ones who felt differently have left. Don't forget the importance of water in that region too.
FWIW, I think it's significant that Mesopotamia, the cradle of civilization is also the scene of so much strife and bloodshed.
This is the crux I think. It's as if we are all staring at some source of both good and bad and some message is trying to get through.
More in a moment. These comments are so good.
I want tell you that today a friend and longtime client died and i am adrift in the sea of salt.
What a way to express it.
Another moment of truth. I always think the whispers in the ears are more plentiful at death.
Maybe, tseka, when the sea diminshes a bit you can tell us about your friend. I'd like to know.
Don't forget the importance of water in that region too.
Absodamnlutely. The big conflicts of the future too, right around the bend.
beauty is sinful
that is what they taught
Heartbreaking. This says what I feel a lot of when I'm circulating in the outer world. Something is reversed it seems.
So it's essentially tribal disputes magnified and echoing generation after generation, so that neither side really knows, anymore, why they hate each other. Except that it's about land, as it always is.
I feel a deeper reason yet.
If the dead could speak they would tell it all
To the weak
And to the old
If the dead could speak they would tell it all
If the dead could speak would they tell us that when you strip everything away only love remains?
When our children die on the battlefield they do not cry out for their leaders they cry out for their mothers, that embrace of everlasting love to fold themselves into again.
We all remember at the core this is all that matters, what we search for,
substitute
so why then are we so frightened?
Attracted to fear?
Pluto is at the GC, the pause, the place of silence, beginnings and endings of cycles. On Astroworld i made a post some time ago of how the Inquisition ran a full pluto cycle. Choices made now appear to have long effect.
But we are also now at the end of an Era that goes back to the Imperial Cult, Empire building begun before the crusades and all the religions chose sides and began this 2,000 year battle of dominion.
My thought, religion has been the policing of people. Seen in the best of light it sets the law and code by which a culture lives.
As Nils-Aslak says
they were noble gentlemen
for them their law
was the law of nature
we, their servents
but their law is not the law of Nature, they did not follow the moon or cycles. We are sick the earth is sick, it is time to feel the creek running in our veins, and the pulse of the earth in our hearts. Yes JM like you i believe there probably is a place for astrology and metaphysics in the next cycle.
We can create visions, stories, songs offer them, they will bring life along because we are attracted to the flikering light of happiness.
We all remember at the core this is all that matters, what we search for,
substitute
so why then are we so frightened?
Attracted to fear?
OMG. Tseka. This is the question I ask.
Thank you Neith, JM for your tenderness.
My friend's last words to me, "There is something I want to tell you...... I love you....................thank you for taking such loving care of me..........."
I saw a young white raven yesterday. One of the children.
We come in, we go out. The wheel turns. Only Love remains; the bridge.
the Inquisition ran a full pluto cycle. Choices made now appear to have long effect.
Very very very interesting. I sense the connection. I want to know.
flikering light of happiness.
I think there is a reason it's so fleeting. Why it seems we have to chase it.
But we are also now at the end of an Era that goes back to the Imperial Cult, Empire building begun before the crusades and all the religions chose sides and began this 2,000 year battle of dominion.
I believe we are emerging from this. I don't think the earth can sustain it anymore. The maintenance of Empire has become impossible.
I always thought the Neocons aborted effort at copying this age old tradition was a sign of the end of it all. In the Cradle itself. It looks ludicrous.
And the wisdom remains too. The wisdom we've been feeling with this transit. The wisdom that remains when the dead in Iraq are buried or burned. The wisdom that was born in Baghdad before Christ. The wisdom that's buried in our chip.
I believe that in the end it doesn't matter what they do. The whole is what it is. The good that we do in our own lives is what matters. And every tiny spec is important.
I think that's what we're doing here. All this Sagittarius energy in synch with the 250 year cycle. You with your Galactic Sun. The time to retrieve the wisdom. The love.
I am in awe of death and I feel that the greatest gifts we receive are left to us in that moment by the dying. They leave us when we're ready and the true legacy is somewhere in the whisper.
Yes
the Circle of Hel
And religion.
It's in our chip. Every single human being knows it and searches for this connection. The psychosis of religion gone wrong is what I think we are stunned by collectively right now. And this is just what will serve to guide us with the arrow point to our own connection, and then the concentric effect with one another. We have to start small.
The deaths in my life have enriched me beyond measure and every time I get close to another one, I feel the sensations all over again. There is nothing remotely like it. The secrets uncovered so briefly.
I learned the truth about my brother and sister when my parents died. In the years following, we got along maybe for the first time. This has lasted. It probably speaks of the parenting I had too.
All I know is that death is one of the greatest teachers I've encountered. My respect knows no match.
I also think every death is significant. It's more than just a body count in Iraq. Each death is part of a neverending story.
I was just doing some reading on December's lunations and noticed the New Moon on Dec 20th. This is going to be a significant day for you, tseka - New Moon conjunct Pluto in Sag!! Seeds to be planted at the Solstice . . .
I'm not a big equinox person. I love them but I don't make a big deal. Pretty much the same with the summer solstice.
But the winter solstice effects me quite a bit and I do end up celebrating it not even trying to. I hadn't even realized this until now.
Maybe it's because of the grand season of celebration surrounding it. Jingling bells and songs and all. It's hard to tell.
Along with the gaiety I sense a profound loneliness late December. I'm sure that adds to the beauty of the day. Mixed with the human light.
There's a genuine desire for real fire. A thirst.
And the arrival of Capricorn, of course, adds its particular flavor.
Quite a full mix.
religion has been the policing of people
I think this is where the world gets confused. Between self, government, and church. Who's in charge?
People created religion out of a need for this assurance of correct behavior. Codes. I think the impulse is good. Then of course like many of man's creations...well, you know.
The problem is fundamental. The minute the reason for doing good comes from outside, it becomes impossible. Until it arises naturally from within each one, from desire, we're in trouble.
That's why I'm an anarchist. A short cut to self discipline.
That New Moon, man. Exact. And it's unusual. One of those out of phase ones. Sagittarius/Cancer lunation. Emotional or what?
Its amazing. And you're right neith about the change from Scorpio to Sagittarius. I feel so different.
The problem is fundamental. The minute the reason for doing good comes from outside, it becomes impossible. Until it arises naturally from within each one, from desire, we're in trouble.
Which is why I have ALWAYS stated legislating morality is doomed to failure!! thump, thump, thump . . . sound of me beating my head against the wall of denial.
That New Moon, man. Exact. And it's unusual. One of those out of phase ones. Sagittarius/Cancer lunation. Emotional or what?
This has been quite a season of dramatic lunations, one right after another. The Full Moon in Gemini is right on my Nodes!!!!! :-)
aaarrrgh!
I feel like my mind has expanded exponentially in the last week.
Which is why I have ALWAYS stated legislating morality is doomed to failure
So why is morality so hard to achieve?
This has been quite a season of dramatic lunations
I think when they're out of phase, and since the Moon rules emotions, there is a noticable difference. This makes me want to study this in depth. They form an an inconjunct which has always interested me. The aspect of crisis, although it can be subtle. But it's right before the balance of the opposition. Trying to get there.
The New Moon is in the USA 1st house and the Full on the Cancer stellium. I think this is particulary powerful for the country, not to mention me with me Cancer Sun, Sag Moon. And tseka...well that's beyond amazing.
Some emotional truth is coming in.
The aspect also can be about health so maybe healing is a potential.
What did you notice about the Moon on your Nodes neith?
What did you notice about the Moon on your Nodes neith?
The Full Moon in Gemini on Dec 4th is the one playing footsie with my nodes . . . so it's wait & see!
BTW, Lynn Hayes has a very interesting post called "A lovely description of Astrology" that is worth a read. She also has Mercury in Scorp and is very good at ferreting out good stuff on the Web.
I read the description of astrology and liked it very much. That Merc in Scorp explains a lot.
I wonder if your added insight and attention to the NN will make a difference. This will be interesting.
I think I already see development. The NN 7th pays more than usual attention to others out of a genuine curiosity when working well. Who they are, what they do, what they like, what they don't like, what they say. The Moon discovery on tseka's Sun is perfect example. Spending time interacting right here and now with the people in your life, and seeing their great importance.
I'm learning to stop doing this and pay more attention to myself! I remember in a health food store 40 years ago a wise women telling me to stop thinking about everyone else.
The coming Full Moon is at 12d Cancer....
USA:Sun at 13
Tseka: Uranus, ruler of ASC at 12
Jm:IC at 12
So glad you brought this up neith.
Spending time interacting right here and now with the people in your life, and seeing their great importance.
That NN in Gemini combined w/Merc in Scorp plus the bleeding heart Moon/Neptune make for someone who is very curious as well as genuinely concerned for the well being of others. What you've done is really brought this into focus for me by drawing attention to the Nodes.
I'm learning to stop doing this and pay more attention to myself!
Do you feel when you are teaching the rest of us, that you are learning more about yourself at the same time? Teaching & Learning are often simultaneous . . .
Do you feel when you are teaching the rest of us, that you are learning more about yourself at the same time?
Absofullydamnlutely.
And you with your SN 1st, neith, are teaching me so much about centering in myself, you have no idea.
someone who is very curious as well as genuinely concerned for the well being of others.
Th thing about the Node is that there is no limit as to how far you can go with this. In fact, the more it's done the better it gets.
And get this....re learning through others.
I was talkig with tseka about her Aquarius/ Cancer and nurturing the collective. Because of you, I just noticed that her Uranus conjuncts the USA Sun making her especially in tune with the needs of the American people.
I remember a lot of her comments on the Sibly chart for the USA and this verifies that she's in tune and correct.
I remember a lot of her comments on the Sibly chart for the USA and this verifies that she's in tune and correct.
Oh yes, and she keeps saying she doesn't know that much about astrology . . . :-)
Gotta tell you, the more I use the Nodes the more they amaze. Remember Casey saying once she gets the theme of someone's chart it just keeps repeating?! By starting with the Nodes, you HAVE the theme and can progress to the embellishments!
BTW . . . Donnie McD has Mars in Libra & a Kite in his chart involving the Sun & outer planets!
This is fascinating neith, and here is how it works. We with the opposite nodes.
You were the one who directed me to my own blog, my own self. This was last July.
Jupiter was just coming off a long station and turning direct exactly on my South Node in Scorpio (interpersonal hell-holes).
Saturn in Leo(self expression) was exactly square.
Pluto the ruler of the SN was exactly opposite my Venus, ruler of the NN Self contentment)...relationships opposite self.
It's so orchestrated it's amazing. And you as the conduit makes perfect sense.
Thank you neith for expellimg me from the hell-hole! I owe you!
OMG! Not another Mars in Libra! Gotta check this out. There is sooooo much Libra round here.
By starting with the Nodes, you HAVE the theme and can progress to the embellishments!
OMG again. In heaven. This is so well stated.
I've been able to read natal charts with mastery for some time because of doing just this.
You seem to feel the excitement and joy of my nodal pals and this delights me.
It's pretty much a rule that when there's trouble in a relationship it's because of the SN. I think it's the kernal of our experience.
The Moon is fertilization and growth on earth. The germination in the dark.
BTW...your NN...Donnie gave his birth info and you immediately looked it up. Gemini curiosity abounding. The endless nonboringness of other people.
It's pretty much a rule that when there's trouble in a relationship it's because of the SN. I think it's the kernal of our experience.
Yay!! Love this stuff!! Now to do some research on this . . . :-)
BTW...your NN...Donnie gave his birth info and you immediately looked it up. Gemini curiosity abounding. The endless nonboringness of other people.
If I have time, or even if I don't, the need to know is a driving force. We won't discuss how young he seems . . . :-)
OMG!!
Did you see neith? He's got your nodes exactly...one degree off. Jupiter in Gemimi too(the youth factor). And a Moon in Libra with the mars.
He IS lively and good with words. And does he ever get around!
His Sun is the exact Sun of the USA at 13 Cancer.
So much here. Saturn in Pisces and his spiritual transformation going on now with Uranus and the NN there. No wonder he's dreaming.
Mercury and Venus exactly conjunct in Leo. Did anyone notice how easily he expresses his love?:-)
Plus...the Leo is exactly conjunct the USA NN. This country needs him.
The Uranus in Virgo square the NN in Gemini and the SN in Sagittarius is the key. This is a person who drives himself nuts trying to figure it all out since he DOES see it all. The Virgo tries to organize the myriad perceptions coming in all the time. The Uranus gives the added flash of insight that comes to him so easily.
Jupiter in Gemini tells the story of a person destined to communicate and teach others with all this perception.
Apparently Katrina was one of those sudden illuminating moments for Donnie when he saw Bush, the Republicans, and his whole lifetime of philosophy go down the Pluto drain.
Would that there were more of these folks. Maybe there are but they don't communicate as much.:-)
And notice the Uranian individuality...a Katrinacrat. One of a kind.
Did you see neith? He's got your nodes exactly...one degree off. Jupiter in Gemimi too(the youth factor). And a Moon in Libra with the mars.
As i was driving home, it popped into my head to check where his Nodes are . . . The guy is born to communicate!
We do need his birth time . . . it's possible if he was born very late in the day his Moon could be in Scorpio. Plus if he really wants the lowdown, we need the correct ASC.
I have to say seeing his gravatar takes me back to the sixties & friends going off to 'Nam . . . and never coming back or coming so changed by death & drugs, they never recovered. When I read these suggestions of bringing back a draft, I just want to wail in pain . . .'cause that would be the result to this country.
I'm going to be watching as the Pluto/Uranus in Virgo generation starts to emerge as a real force to be reckoned with in this country.
have to say seeing his gravatar takes me back to the sixties & friends going off to 'Nam . . . and never coming back or coming so changed by death & drugs, they never recovered. When I read these suggestions of bringing back a draft, I just want to wail in pain . . .'cause that would be the result to this country.
I hear ya, neith. I have some thoughts on this I'll post later.
I know what you mean about the memory of Nam.
I don't know. The Virgo generation with its emphasis on service might bring back a draft. With the Mars progression and the broken military it could happen. The young people of today are out of shape and out of touch with the whole concept. Service used to be unquestioned.
Maybe an alternative kind of service will come with the Uranus involved. It used to be a great source of pride to do something for the country and now....what pride? It will have to be restored, and fortunately it won't be by military conquest.
iI don't know. The Virgo generation with its emphasis on service might bring back a draft. With the Mars progression and the broken military it could happen. The young people of today are out of shape and out of touch with the whole concept. Service used to be unquestioned.
I've wondered about this myself. The last two years that i was LTC Ombudsman we began running into the children of residents who are of the age to have Pluto in Virgo. A new group with a new attitude and one rather shocking to us, it became a huge topic -how to deal with these children.
A typical example. Mom is on sub-acute wing of a skilled nursing facility, she breathes only with the assistance of a ventilator, she is still able to communicate her desires, she finds that her quality of life is acceptable and her condition is stable but declining, she is months away from death as long as she has the nursing care and the vent. She has no instructions via an advanced directive. After interviewing the client an advanced directive is created and she signs that she wants full code...all means necessary to keep her alive.
Her daughter challenges the decision, in fact wants the vent removed immediately, she believes she has the right to overrule her mother, escalates the situation, brings in all the relatives accuses us of "stealing" her money. (all Ombudsmen work without any compensation -there's the service we all grew up knowing was part of our legacy) In the end mom gets what she wants because the law says she has the right to decide her own care as long as she is able.
Time after time we encountered these scenarios -a bottom line- since mom is going to die in a few months why drain her estate and have the facility get all the money and assets? Because a friend pointed out that this was a Pluto in Virgo response we bagan to call these children Pluto in Virgo.
I am sure that this is only one expression of Pluto in Virgo and there are a multitude of potential others. What concerned us was that we saw the new administrators hired from this age group carried similar values, all about the bottom line- and care suffered. Great for corporations however.
As we move into a future with limited resources and an aging population these issues are going to have to be dealt with, or hidden...and that is faily easy to do, nursing homes are one of our great shames in the country.
As an advocate for compassionate health care in this country i am keeping my antennae alert to this trend.
Maybe Donnie and Kadimiros have solutions with their venus conjuct mars. They are both far-seers. We need to make strong links between generations. My own thought about Pluto in Capricorn is that issues like these will be in the forefront.
Sorry it took so long to get back. Work has continued to be a thorn in my side with always relying on my so much. Part of the reason that I feel on the verge of burn out. Ya'll seem to have hit upon some things about me that are really in-line.
So where do I begin? I can see things that most cannot. I cannot explain it, I just know things are gonna happen. I can take a trip out of body and travel to where my heart desires, I can see things in the future, I can see things in the past, I can feel the dead and know when they are around. I have taken pics of ghost and at times, they drew me back to places I was about to leave, just to take a pic. Only to see them in the pics after the fact.
I once met an older woman while in the Marines that told me I had rearsight, foresight, and healing abilities. She also pointed out one of the dippers in the sky and said that I was led by Chris, Nile, Nil and Gil that were the stars off one of the dipper's stars. I think it might have been the little dipper.
Kinda of why I told JM not to fear the elections and I popped open the bottle of celebration wine a day early. I knew it was gonna happen!
tseka, isak dinesen said:
The cure for anything is salt water: sweat, tears or the salt sea.
so sorry about your friend.
I will have to try to find out the time of the day for my birth. I don't have that info on me. I do know that my mother knows how to read fortunes and does it with a regular deck of cards.
I have also been known to have open eyed visions on rare Occasions. Those are by far the most misunderstood things that I do. I really don't know how to read them and usually have to wait to see what they meant.
I have only come across a couple of people that were able to try to put a dent in my mental wall that blocks people out unless I let them in. Of those, I only had one of them I felt was a potential threat and I hit them with everything I had. I had only one thought in my mind after that, the word PLEASE!! So I showed mercy and let them go.
That is why I talk to JM about me being a warrior. Not just because I was in the Marines, but I can fight in ways that no one else can. I usually don't talk about these things to just anyone, but I feel that people here might understand.
Donnie, you are one of us the native people i grew up with call us seed children, the ancient scandinavians called us sky or star children, we are people for whom time has little meaning or boundaries little value.
And it's all good.
Casey thanks for your kindness, my freind has been ready for release for a long while, this earth was a hard place for her. For her i feel gladness, the sea of salt is being among those who love her wanted to hold her for a little longer...her son especially who is young.
Yes Donnie you are a spirit-warrior, my son is one as well. We look to you to help us find the "tomte" energy. Mars in libra is one signature of this pattern, my son shares it as do i& Jm. and it seems connected to the next phase of the American identity.
Perhaps those with astro-wisdom here can shed more light on that pattern of the spirit-mars in libra.
Oh, the tomte energy is the "void" and it's point is the day of tomas 21 dec which receives the light of Ullr. Go back a few posts and you can find more on this...tomas is the emptyness that is so empty it is full it is the dark matter of the cosmos, the great potential from which all things arise, activated by light....in those posts you will find some information on Tyr the spritual warrior connected to polaris and the Dipper, perhaps it will speak to you.
in those posts you will find some information on Tyr the spritual warrior connected to polaris and the Dipper, perhaps it will speak to you.
Do you think that is what she meant? Do you know anything about the names I mentioned that was told to me by the woman? I do not know the full details, yet I can walk between worlds. My natural abilites are limited by the lack of training from a teacher. I often find myself teaching something, but I know not where it comes from. Strange!
BTW Tseka, I sense a wound that has not healed. Not just the recent things, but something else that you may have forgot. But the wound was never fully healed. You may have learned to live with it. When I think about you, I sense the presence of a Sparrow. A little bird that flies around you. That sparrow is not a big bird, but it gives you hope and reminds you of a place you can get peace. The peaceful Sparrow is your guide and wants to help you when you have lost your sight. It wants to help you fly south for the winter so to speak.
I also see a Robin with Neith, a dove with JM, and a big hearty crow with Joe.
OMG, Donnie . . . on her website is a photo of tseka w/a bird on her shoulder. Unfortunately I can't get the picture to open there but I believe it's a sparrow! Tseka has an amazing gift for the wild creatures . . . and it's North to Puget Sound she yearns to go. What a gift you have there!
I also see a Robin with Neith
Well, I like the cheeky birds except when they eat Half of the strawberry that I had my eye on. :-)
Now more than ever I'm curious to see what having a birth time does to your chart. It would appear with we share the same North Node in Gemini, and the need to seek out good information & spread it out for others. Usually the time of birth is on the Birth Certificate . . . and we all know how the Military bureaucracy just loves it's documents, so they must have asked for that real early on.
Donnie i am aware of the Wound and it is ancient.
The path often seems difficult and that we have no "teacher" but you would be surprised...one and 14 always exist around you, all the time. When you are ready it unfolds. I have always known, i was fortunate born, into a family well aware of these gifts that go back to unknown times, and early years spent on a Salish reservation.
Small birds, sparrow, finches and verdins often catch a ride on my shoulder, friends. Raven speaks to me as do Bobcats. But so have cedar trees. In the right moments.
I am overwhelmed, humbled, and for the moment almost silenced by what I've just read on this thread. A revelation. Totally unexpected in its magnitude.
Donnie, I can't believe this. I am thrilled that you've decided to reveal your true self here. I must have known since I was so unnmistakably drawn to something in you that wasn't being said. I've
been waiting for this insight, added to what I feel so lucky already to have found in everyone here.
I have so much to say when my voice comes back fully. There is a treasure chest in these few paragraphs.
It was prophetic. I knew "I found it."
So fascinating Donnie about your mother.
This political experience has been one of the most amazing things I've witnessed and I knew all along a great reward was hidden in it. Bush's SN at 19 Sagittarius in the 5th was a clue as well as his Cancer planets on out USA ones. And the Pluto in Leo on his ASC destroying and recreating.
This is what is coming out of the ashes as Pluto goes to the GC. A recognition of ourselves and each other and a real spiritual growth.
The year ahead will be fantastic as we share our knowledge that hasn't seen light yet.
I am overwhelmed, humbled, and for the moment almost silenced by what I've just read on this thread. A revelation. Totally unexpected in its magnitude.
What a wonderful surprise, huh?! :-) And across all these time zones too. I admit to being more than a little blown away myself. Never underestimate those Loosianna boys . . .
You know I don't cry much, but the Moon is in Pisces today, and the thought of a Republican Marine, aging Hippies, Left wing politicos, and assorted creatures coming together like this and finding commonality is what I dream of and has the potential of releasing the salt. And the shared thing is spiritual. Something's happening.
I always hope for the time when we can be free from the confines of the past and its guilt, and take the lessons to leap ahead innocently to the unknown.
Never underestimate those Loosianna boys
HA HA HA!!!!
Neith, we must look into these birds. The robin is one of my favorites and it immediately struck me as accurate. The robin is so "there" like the anchor of them all. I wrote a song about them in Santa Fe when their early morning singing echoed in a certain way that entranced me. They seem less nervous than the other birds. And contenet with themselves.
I don't really know much about the dove, but I'm going to find out.
The sparrow as well. But its slenderness and slightness that belie its power fit tseka in my mind. They are associated with churches I think.
Oh there is so much to cover!
And across all these time zones too. I admit to being more than a little blown away myself.
Once again, you initiated the big step by bringing in the chart analysis yesterday. You are so wise neith.
big hearty crow with Joe.
Crows, man. Are they powerful or what? And joe always talks about his destiny with his power.
This is so fascinating.
You know I don't cry much, but the Moon is in Pisces today, and the thought of a Republican Marine, aging Hippies, Left wing politicos, and assorted creatures coming together like this and finding commonality is what I dream of and has the potential of releasing the salt. And the shared thing is spiritual. Something's happening.
This is a dream I share happily. And you realize today is the day of Mars sq Saturn in Leo . . to me, this is just another exclamation point in the series of synchronicities we've enjoyed. And we are an assorted group, yes we are!! I LOVE it!!!
Crows, man. Are they powerful or what? And joe always talks about his destiny with his power.
Joe in his quiet way is one relentless fellow . . . and that humor of his!
Darn Robins are pretty unflappable, aren't they?! (can't believe i said that, you wordsmiths are rubbing off on me!) We have to net our strawberries & blueberries to prevent them from eating them all. They don't scare easily . . . hmmmm
I am REALLY overwhelmed. But I do want to voyage into the Mars in Libra territory.
I have a great reference on this. I will consult.
Libra I think is the sign of war in its conceptual stages and as a path to ultimate peace. Look at our USA Mars progression in Libra now and what's happening. There is an entire encyclopedia on this subject and I think with the insight pouring in now, it would be most illuminating to delve deeply into this. Especially with all the Libra here.
Where is the real source of peace and cooperation? Mars in Libra intends to find it.
They don't scare easily . . . hmmmm
Ya know neith. This has amazed me. You are so much like this. Water off a duck's back too when people are mean sometimes.
I think this is your ancient lesson of self in the SN in the 1st. The warrior to the max. The one who doesn't have to fight the battles anymore.
Robins eat so much. They're robust, healthy, and first in line!
For the last 30 years, being a night person, I have been listening to the calls of the robins, usually somewhere about 3:00 AM. They herald the new day. All is completely silent when they speak.
Mars in Libra.
Mars is solo, Libra is one on one relationship.
Mars is what we desire and pursue actively. Mars in Libra wants relationship more than anything but resents the leaving of self in order to come together. Quarreling is common as a result so the Mars can go back to the solo position and re-establish identity. The Mars pushes away what it really wants.
It is such a cath-22. The Mars in Libra is learning how to maintain identity in human exchange. If this is achieved then the crossing of borders in war becomes unnecessary as we don't need to possess what the other has. We can share it. Take it or leave it, since we have enough of our own.
As the USA learns about this with the Mars retro in Libra coming back to the Saturn, she should find some peace. All of us Mars in Libras fit in perfectly as we learn to cooperate no matter where we came from or how we got here.
So Mars in Libra shares and cooperates not because she's supposed to, but because she desires it.
Libra I think is the sign of war in its conceptual stages and as a path to ultimate peace. Look at our USA Mars progression in Libra now and what's happening.
Many generals have Libra prominent in their charts. They can weigh information dispassionately, too detached maybe?! The danger of Air is that very detachment, IMO.
So Mars in Libra shares and cooperates not because she's supposed to, but because she desires it.
Oh very good point! As has been noted before, we have to CHOOSE to behave . . .
The danger of Air is that very detachment, IMO.
Absolutely. But it swings both ways.
The lessons of the warrior are vast. The ultimate goal being no bloodshed, but a spiritual protection and strength. The Libra strategy that leads to prevention.
This absurd no strategy war this country is in now is the turning point.
It's interesting that a lot of military people I've been talking to lately are coming around to this view. That active combat isn't working now.
Fascinating neith!!!!!
The Mars square Saturn today has us sheathing our swords!
This absurd no strategy war this country is in now is the turning point.
I certainly hope so. All signs seem to be pointing in that direction even if the rhetoric in high places hasn't changed.
Donnie can probably give us better feedback on this but I do recall learning in martial arts that the ultimate goal was to win the fight without having to strike a blow.
Somewhere I read something I felt had merit about the Country withdrawing because of the Mars in Libra moving back to Saturn. I'll see if I can follow my tracks back . . Most of the "doom & gloom" astrologers are really beginning to annoy me . . . which is why I so enjoy the company around here!!
The Mars square Saturn today has us sheathing our swords!
And this is the one I've been peeping at out of the corner of my eye because involves my ASC!!!
If you look at the whole scenario from the metaphysical perspective. it's revealing. As the Mars squares saturn in Scorpio just before entering Sagittarius, the end is here.
Bush's clinging to his illusion is just the grain of sand that is driving the world to see the neccesity of a political solution. He needs to stay where he is as part of the whole. He has nothing to do with the unfolding events anyway. He's an emtpy something or other. No one is paying attention to him.
Mars is the last one to leave Scorpio in this plumbing cycle. What more fitting planet. And the square to Saturn in Leo now is showing clearly how pride is not maintained by killing people.
We're in a quandary. And part of the collective who wants a solution to this impossible conflict. It will leave us when we're ready.
Most of the "doom & gloom" astrologers are really beginning to annoy me . . . which is why I so enjoy the company around here!!
They have been annoying me for a long time as you well know. They're a blight to the science.
The gloom and doom is about their own lives. Issues they won't confront so they hook it on a hoped for dark destiny outside to make them feel better. Not so alone. And no real courage is required. All to bolster their negative life view. Lack of faith.
Then they get trapped in their predictions and hope for a negative outcome to prove that they were right and maintain credibility.
It's perfectly all right to perceive this way but it has little to do with reality. So I don't follow it.
It's too bad that people can't consolidate and try to get out of the horror. By repeating gloom and doom, nothing gets done and this merely reinforces the perpetrators' power. Keep them huddled and afraid.
Most soldiers that have experienced the real thing will put energy into a better solution.
Mars is the last one to leave Scorpio in this plumbing cycle. What more fitting planet. And the square to Saturn in Leo now is showing clearly how pride is not maintained by killing people.
Actually it's Mercury but Hey, who better to have the last, very biting word! Perhaps that suggests that ultimately it will be diplomacy that resolves this.
We have the Full Moon in mutables next Monday involving Uranus so there will LOTS of words flying around. The Full Moon post is up over on Astrowisdom...very upbeat one.
I am heading home from a quiet day at work . . . and a most enjoyable day visiting with friends here. Check in after a bit!!
I know astrologically, intuitively, and from common sense that it's time for this country to cut George Bush and this adminstration loose.
Actually it's Mercury but Hey, who better to have the last, very biting word! Perhaps that suggests that ultimately it will be diplomacy that resolves this.
Excellent point!
I am heading home from a quiet day at work . . . and a most enjoyable day visiting with friends here. Check in after a bit!!
Thanks for the input neith!
And this from today's paper:
It's the season of peace, but the residents of the Loma Linda neighborhood in Pagosa Springs have been at war with one another.
And the object of their fight?
The peace symbol.
That says it. Mars in Libra. The residents put up a wreath in the form of a peace symbol and it caused the ruckus at the homeowner's assoc. They were told to take it down. More ruckus.
Then this outcome from the homeowneer's board:
We had a misunderstanding and for that we apologize. We withdraw any and all previous requests for removal of your decoration.
Gloom and doom? In some quarters yes. But along side is a real look at war and peace. Peace won this one.
Love it JM! Peace on earth
Here's some tidbits
the points on the wheel around 14 15 cancer [just beyond Sirius degree, remember both Hel (wholeness healing) and Loki (chaos testing) came from Sirius] = uproarius tone, time of Ravens. also oddly, to "put a bit into a mouth the crown of something" but it rather makes sense if interpreted with poetic help..
Birds shaped words into Tones
Talking sounded from the crowns of Trees
the Kalevala, where Hel is wrapping the magic into bundles for her copper-lined boxes
13 14 Gemini: arrow, messenger,
there is a sense in here of transmiting what is eternal or everlasting
17 18 gemini: poet, female swan
Some pretty accurate namnsdags for Suns and NN here...
I'm hoping for a bit more time now to settle in for some long evenings of research...that time of ravens really catches my eye. Perhaps a gate - i'll need to look carefully, i would not be surprised.
the sag -> taurus bullseye you mentioned, yes indeed JM the ullr pause at GC just prior to solstice turns up as Uller (the masculine energy of ullr) goes underground through a gate on 19 May the namnsdag Elder. PS its the portal of the fairies!
I'm hoping for a bit more time now to settle in for some long evenings of research...that time of ravens really catches my eye. Perhaps a gate - i'll need to look carefully, i would not be surprised.
This will be good to help prepare for a birth day/solstice to remember. Stephanie Austin who writes the lunation articles for Mountain Astrologer has some very interesting things to say about that New Moon & the GC. Right now it's not available online, darn. I suspect from the direction you seem to be turning to you know there will be much coming in to process and disseminate in your unique fashion.
some long evenings of research
That sounds absolutely delectable.
I think it's going to be a great year with our desire for learning and this central place to disseminate. I'm excited.
put a bit into a mouth the crown of something
This makes so much sense. A lot here.
With my 12 IC, your 12 Cancer and Donnie's 13.
The bit is part of the pull away from my IC with the coming Capricorn to the 12 MC. Have to think about this. The "bit" has been on my mind continually for the last year. I can actually feel it in my mouth.
Very interesting.
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