Wednesday, February 21, 2007

Saturn Revisited with a North Node in the Eighth thrown in

In keeping with Pluto coming into Capricorn to square my Mars, Ag arrived at Raging Universe yesterday, and wouldn't you know it? .... a Capricorn. It looks like I'm in trouble. I will have to straighten up, bite the bullet, and work like I never have before (Mars in the 6th). Her question, of course, was about her Saturn. In Gemini.He also has the NN in the 8th house, but the SN in Cancer is also significant, so I would like to go into the Saturn and nodes a bit now, and come back to the chart when we do the Cancer/Capricorn nodes.
This is an highly talented and creative man with a huge drive toward relationship, as shown by his full 5th house of self expression, and all of his planets in the interpersonal sector of the chart, except Saturn. This places a special emphasis on the Saturn. Pluto in the 5th, particularly seeks attention, adulation, and recognition, and can often cause resentment of those who find the spotlight easily, until they get in it themselves.
The Sun and Jupiter are conjunct the NN in the 8th, and this is fantastic. There is a ego, vitality, and shine, together with the regenerative NN pointing to big potential success.

In a previous article, I talked about the blocks Saturn puts in our paths, in order to develop expertise in that sector of life, and assure the realization of the goals of the chart. Saturn in the first is a block to moving out into life at all. There is hesitation, maybe timidity, inhibition. A lack of spontaneity, as they strive to calculate their moves. A locked-in sensation.
Saturn in the first is learning to thrust, conquer, dominate, and impose the will, all with Saturnian reserve. They are unlocking aggression, surviving and defending themselves well, and impacting the environment. Coming out of their shells. The ruling Mercury is conjunct Venus, so it will look lovely. All the better as he asserts his singularity and broadcasts his identity.

And the MO of this Saturn is broadcasting, whether it be speaking, writing, teaching, or any other form of communication. Getting the word out. The Saturn blocks the natural flow and these natives often feel like they aren't being heard, understood, or valued intellectually. They often feel like they need more information and education, and never know when enough is enough. They feel overlooked and undervalued, but often they are of superior intelligence, and just need self-recognition to resolve the dilemma.
Mercury is fast. The Winged Messenger. Sense impressions come in and are swiftly connected to thought in the mind. Saturn is complex structure and slows down this process as thoughts have to travel his matrix on the way out. This can manifest in many ways. Hesitation in speaking up, feeling disconnected, blurting out too fast, not finding the right words, or dissatisfied with the results after hard labor.
But Saturn is discipline, and the end result is a master of communication, finding exactly the right phrases without too many words, knowing enough to back up statements well, and stopping people in their tracks, as they are compelled to listen. A gravity of tone and respect from others come in time. All essential to the 1st house identity.
The Capricorn planets in Ag's 8th give great focus and concentration and the ability to get the most from his mental powers. The NN is the Ace, promising big success in a gradual climb. The SN in Cancer is the Achille's heel, as uneeded emotional involvements interfere with the use of the extensive personal power.
Saturn's a good one. More later .......

36 Comments:

Blogger Tseka said...

Another supporting set up is found in the 7th with all the points around the Great Attractor

"Within this moment, and the next appearing moments, attention goes to those things that allegedly attract the essence of one's spirit. This attraction intends to lead to a yet unseen consciousness, platform, doctrine, agenda or purpose for being. In the more mundane, these definitions can become a philosophical statement or a marketing theme and may lead to the promulgation of policy. On a more personal level, a commitment to one's soulful causes strengthens. This becomes a starting block for the formation of ideas that go way beyond what is now consciously seen and known."


The choice of yogic discipline appears to be an integral part of this journey.

The thing about the Great Attractor, people seem to either love or hate you adding a lot of emphasisi to the 7th's lesson.

21/2/07 7:33 AM  
Blogger Neith said...

And this is in my 1st house just a couple of degrees from my SN . . . :-) Just another example of why neutrality is a key concept for me . . . no hooks, just stay smooth & clear.

Did anyone else go to ag's website?! :-)

21/2/07 9:06 AM  
Blogger Neith said...

OK - that was strange. Blogger changed the site link to the date! Let's try that again . . .

21/2/07 9:09 AM  
Blogger Neith said...

Nope - won't work, so just click on the date that's underlined in blue and it will take you to ag's website.

21/2/07 9:10 AM  
Blogger Tseka said...

Ja, abd i know that Kad visited "acoustic god" some threads back which is what motivated me.

21/2/07 9:13 AM  
Anonymous AG said...

Hi there!

Where to start? Yes, I did post a website as I figured that would be the quickest route to my astrological info. In explanation, beyond a little narcissism, I was encouraged quite awhile back to share some of my discovered information on myself at the astrology forum I frequent (linda-goodman.com). I didn't think it would be right to monopolize pages and pages of a thread copying and pasting all of bits of information I've collected on myself, so I created that site and just gave them a link to browse at their own leisure.

Yes, I'm a guy (and not at all offended at the assumption that I could be otherwise - I think I'm actually the woman in my relationship), and I've used AcousticGod as a screen name for quite some time. That name should probably be retired at some point as I'm quite aware that the inclusion of "God" makes me sound a bit pompous (My girlfriend [prior to us going out] was told by one of my online friends that she should meet me, and she almost didn't call because of my screen name. She's a Sag.). That is why I showed up here as simply "AG". I've been thinking about the name, "Aural," lately.

Incidentally, John Mayer would more aptly be described as an acoustic god, than I would. I've played guitar for about 16 years now, but never really aspired to be a guitar icon. Here's some of my [mostly non-guitar] music: http://www.acidplanet.com/artist.asp?songs=549785&T=9023 (I don't know the html tag for linking). If you look on the left of that page I've got a couple more profiles there as well.

When looking at my chart struggles I tend to think that maybe I'm intended to be a known musician. That's the most persistent hobby and love I've had in my life. I've been playing music since Junior High. I was given piano lessons due to my picking up songs by ear.

Ok, I think that's enough for now. I'm going to look into the Great Attractor.

:)

21/2/07 11:33 AM  
Anonymous AG said...

Oh, and thanks to JM for looking at my chart!

21/2/07 11:35 AM  
Blogger jm said...

OMG! I was though of as a man til I revealed my gender.

That's wonderful!

Now on to this other revelation.

21/2/07 1:49 PM  
Blogger jm said...

That name should probably be retired at some point as I'm quite aware that the inclusion of "God" makes me sound a bit pompous

And what's wrong with that?

Sun/Jupiter conjunction wouldn't mind.


I like the name, ag very much. It's true that many recoil from ego expression, yet they follow it blindly in unadvanced people.

I see the value in shortening it, but then again, when will we understand that we are all godlike supposedly, or aspiring to that?

Very interesting subject

I think this is a great subject from a packed 5th house and sun/jupiter, which I will refer to from now on as Sun joop.

21/2/07 2:04 PM  
Blogger jm said...

When looking at my chart struggles I tend to think that maybe I'm intended to be a known musician. That's the most persistent hobby and love I've had in my life

Interesting. I'm intended to be a known musician.

So that means you believe in predestination?

This is absolutley fascinating. The first time I had my chart read he said that I had something many musicians have. I was in the midst of making a decision between film school and becoming a professional musician. The decision was pretty much made, but what a joy that sentence was to my musical ears.

It's a Mars/Neptune conjunction. You have it too.

The ruler of you 10th house of career is in the 5th house of creativity and self-expresion. So that's that.

Now you can do anything. Fish for sardines and get recognition. But if there is a calling or at least inclinations, your chart is one of an artist of some kind, with the full capability of professional achievemnt with your talent.

The reality of this life is complicated. Lots of us here are artists. Tseka and I have made a living doing it. But the levels I know I aspire to are difficult in a world that resists "acoustic gods" and embraces acoustic mayhem, pop icon madness, and all out imitation of art.

If you can come with soemthing, let me know!

21/2/07 2:19 PM  
Blogger jm said...

Your Actions rating is 38 out of 100.
Saturn in the 1st house.

Your Competence rating is 100 out of 100.
Capriorn.

Your Dutiful rating is 85 out of 100.
Hey! Should be more being a Cap!

Your Self-discipline rating is 50 out of 100
Bad Capricorn! Bad! Bad!
Mars/Neptune, Sun joop, Venus/Neptune.

Your Positive Emotions rating is 63 out of 100.
Needs work. You've come to the right place.

21/2/07 2:35 PM  
Blogger jm said...

OMG!!! NO!!!!

your Gregarious rating is 25 out of 100.

Saturn again. The sun joop is very expressive of exhuberance (as much as Cap can), warmth, and confidence. And all the sagittarius. People are good for you, as long as you know and show your separate identity.

21/2/07 2:40 PM  
Anonymous Joe said...

This is so interesting. Not surprisingly, I'm seeing echoes of myself in AG's chart and its interpretation. AG, you said you were born at least 20 years or so before me, on the same date. Can our planets really be that similar, with that many years' difference? I wonder...

21/2/07 4:23 PM  
Blogger jm said...

Joe he was born in 1972. You're thinking of anon who is posting on the SN Taurus thread. Very interesting chart, but entirely different from yours.

It's absolutely fascinating as you can see the influence of the time of day and the ASC.

21/2/07 4:39 PM  
Blogger jm said...

So you have things in common with both, but much more with ag who has the same ASC, although he was born Dec. 26.

21/2/07 4:41 PM  
Anonymous Joe said...

oh, OK. Then that makes a lot more sense.

21/2/07 4:44 PM  
Anonymous AcousticGod said...

I'm finally back. I posted this morning, and everyone was quiet.

Yeah, the AcousticGod name worked well as a generic name that said at least a little bit about my life. I say it worked well, because I haven't encountered any/many places where an 'AcousticGod' already exists. I'd say that as a forum name it's generally served me pretty well. People can easily tell my name from others, and that helps in establishing an identity I think.

Sun/Jupiter conjunction, I like the idea, but that's a pretty big orb, right? Or is it an aspect that can have a big orb since it's an easy aspect?

You know what's weird? I've been into astrology for long enough to know some things, and yet I don't often consider my 5th house packed. I've generally seen my 7th house stellium, and that's it as far as bundles of energy go. It is a good thing, though. I've always been creative.

So that means you believe in predestination?

It's very possible. It just seems like music is awfully persistent in my life regardless of my not having really pursued it much (or for very long). As a Capricorn with Jupiter in Capricorn I definitely think I can achieve success later than most musicians. I never worry about being too old.

Also, about predestination, I think that ultimately there would probably be an even greater achievement beyond the superficial fame. With my Aqua MC I think I'm supposed to do some good in this world. I tend to think that my means of accomplishing that may be through fame. Would that make sense?

I think I'll post this now, and then continue on.

21/2/07 4:58 PM  
Blogger jm said...

acousticgod.
Great question.

Sun/Jupiter conjunction, I like the idea, but that's a pretty big orb, right? Or is it an aspect that can have a big orb since it's an easy aspect?

I read all planets in the same sign as conjunctions, the closer, the more magnetic attraction and repulsion goes on. But with wide orbs they still work together.

The Sun joop is a karmic gift, even with its excesses and problems. It's an infinite expansion of the ego, absolutely necessary for an artist. The artist is looking for a relection of himself in his work. This is not a plumber, or a nurse.

The 5th house, Leo, or strong Suns are vital to artistic expression. You have to recognize your own significance, superiority even, since they will not, unless you do.

You have an extremely powerful 5th with the Moon/Pluto there. I also have Pluto in the 5th.
This is the deepest most regenerative creative power one can have, and it's daunting. The creative output is bottomless, but the desire for recognition can be bottomless too, and very difficult to handle.

This is why I like your moniker as you call yourself god with no shame or embarrassment.

The ruler of the 10th in the 5th is very significant. I have this too and there is no doubt about my artistic calling.

Lots more on this.

21/2/07 5:13 PM  
Blogger jm said...

many composers have much Capricorn. The Mars/Neptune is the transcendent grace and beauty. I also have this. Mars/Neptune is like an athlete or dancer, so the physical grace of music is wonderful to us, as it courses through our bodies.

Also, about predestination, I think that ultimately there would probably be an even greater achievement beyond the superficial fame

Great great subject. How superficial is fame?

21/2/07 5:17 PM  
Blogger Kadimiros said...

"I read all planets in the same sign as conjunctions, the closer, the more magnetic attraction and repulsion goes on. But with wide orbs they still work together."

I think I recall hearing that ancient astrologers counted aspects by sign rather than by degree. So two planets could be in aspect by sign though later astrologers might dismiss them for being out of orb. Orbs, while handy, are probably not a rigid phenomena.

21/2/07 5:26 PM  
Blogger jm said...

Thank you kadimiros. This is my view, even though I sometimes speak in less than glowing terms about the ancients..:-)

I know this is right which is why I use aspects loosely. Definitely misleading to use rigidity. It also prevents seeing the whole mandala.

21/2/07 5:30 PM  
Blogger jm said...

The connection of Capricorn and Saturn to the Sun is very interesting.

I have Saturn in the 5th, which is like a Sun in Cap in ways. Leo energy pours out sometimes in an almost diarrhetic fashion. What Saturn does, is capture this output and send it through its system to gain control and effectiveness. The difference between superficial fame and more solid attention. The difference between a stripper and a classical pianist.

So Sun/Saturn artists want reserve, high style, dignity, and the highest quality as their self expression. The audience wants anything and everything, usually more of the diarretic. So a strong ego is required to keep it in control and not give into outside demands for cheap thrills.

21/2/07 5:39 PM  
Anonymous AcousticGod said...

Actions Rating:
That's pretty bad. Perhaps that's why I'm here doing this instead of finishing my resume so I can get back into the workforce.

Competence Rating:
Very impressive! I am smart. There are competency lapses, though, when I'm not into the job, or pursuing my own agenda. I occasionally have memory problems as well, because I don't place as much importance on some things as other people do.

Dutiful Rating:
Well, you'd think that being a Cap with a Virgo Moon it would be higher, but I do have Gemini's restlessness. I'm a water rat in chinese astrology, which are supposed to be, "unapologetic promoters of their own agendas," which could lend to one's being a little less dutiful.

Self-Discipline Rating:
Yeah, I always feel I could be better at that. Typically it is good for me (Jupiter in Cap) when I act like a Capricorn.

Positive Emotions Rating:
I'm glad it's over 50%. That Sag optimism at work. The more I know about myself, the easier it is for me to be comfortable with myself. I've grown a lot through astrology, and become better and more confident as a result. I may have little pity parties right now in my life since I'm unemployed, but I know that's temporary.

Gregarious Rating:
That's an interesting one. This is kind of an area where I can go both ways, at least to a degree. Growing up a had a sort of double life where at school I was well-liked but not popular, and at church I was both well-liked and popular (I grew up going to a huge church). So I felt and acted like a celebrity at church, and at school I felt a bit restricted by what people expected from me.
I am fairly reserved as a person now, but I do crave social interaction. I keep saving my city's seasonal activites guides, so I can eventually go join in on some of the classes or something. Haven't actually done it yet, though. One of the most unusual social gatherings I have tried within the last year and a half is going to a Cuddle Party. It's like my 5th house and Gem Rising like to mess with my Cap Sun.

One thing I'll say about a concentration in the 5th is that I DO love my entertainment! I am a sitcom and comedy junkie. My girlfriend said not long ago that she was surprised by the shows I watch on tv. She said she would have guessed me for being one to watch more educational stuff, but I told her I to be entertained, and I like to watch shows about relationships. Even the murder mystery shows that are so popular don't do anything for me.

21/2/07 5:44 PM  
Blogger Kadimiros said...

"The difference between superficial fame and more solid attention. The difference between a stripper and a classical pianist."

LOL Great comparison. Hmm, although I suspect I wouldn't mind an attractive pianist who was willing to strip for me.

21/2/07 5:50 PM  
Anonymous AcousticGod said...

Sadly, I have to go now. My Sag has an ADHD support group that she wants me to attend. I probably have that too, but I deal with it through astrology. See you all later tonight.

21/2/07 5:50 PM  
Blogger jm said...

I can get back into the workforce.

NO!!!! Not there!!!
Gainfully employed you mean?

I don't place as much importance on some things as other people do.

Really?

I'm a water rat in chinese astrology, which are supposed to be, "unapologetic promoters of their own agendas," which could lend to one's being a little less dutiful.

Very interesting. I'm an earth rat. I'd like to be an unapologetic promoter of this agenda. I so love the lack of apology. I believe in saving it for when I REALLY do something wrong.

I've grown a lot through astrology, and become better and more confident as a result.

Great news.

I may have little pity parties right now in my life since I'm unemployed, but I know that's temporary.

LOL!!!!!!! I would reverse that!!!! You can celebrate your unemployment here.

I told her I to be entertained, and I like to watch shows about relationships.

So relationships are entertaining to you?? Good approach. I find people amusing sometimes, myself.

Interesting about the ease at church. Says a lot.

21/2/07 5:55 PM  
Blogger jm said...

Later acousticgod....

21/2/07 5:56 PM  
Blogger jm said...

although I suspect I wouldn't mind an attractive pianist who was willing to strip for me.

Now that depends on the mood, don't you think. Stripping to Mahler or Ravel would be two entirely different experiences.

21/2/07 5:58 PM  
Blogger jm said...

The Sun is supposed to be confidence in the chart, but I think Jupiter represents this just as much, maybe more. The Sun is self love and feelings of importance, but Jupiter is beyond love. It's godlike might, and probably not too concerned about personal love.

21/2/07 6:08 PM  
Blogger jm said...

The artist is looking for a relection of himself in his work. This is not a plumber

That's funny.

21/2/07 6:13 PM  
Blogger jm said...

Sadly, I have to go now. My Sag has an ADHD support group that she wants me to attend.

Did you see this joe? What is going on here?

21/2/07 6:45 PM  
Blogger Tseka said...

Sadly, I have to go now. My Sag has an ADHD support group that she wants me to attend.

Did you see this joe? What is going on here?


A good question, Pluto in Libra?? Let's keep it all even and nice. When did we start with the Ritalin in schools? 80's

Finally my friends who teach are speaking of a return to the "Art" of education rather than the "legislation" of education.
Wonder what pluto in Cap will have to say about that?

21/2/07 7:52 PM  
Anonymous Joe said...

I dunno, jm. I don't have ADHD, but they were starting Ritalin, as Tseka says, in the 80s's.

21/2/07 8:02 PM  
Blogger Tseka said...

I've been pinning big hopes on Saturn in Leo to sort some of the education mess out. Actually a lot of dreams that began in the "60s" have taken some bizarre turns and could be resuscitated with some discipline and Leo enthusiasm. Enthusiasm is the item in short supply these days. I recall 35 years ago watching a film (Marshall McLuhan?) on how we all would be living a life of leisure by this date. Looking back i had so much more leisure then. Less stress. Worked less.

Even when all the indicators are so obvious, the path does not take us where we think we are headed, it's what's lying in the shadows, and the bushes that trips us up.

21/2/07 8:19 PM  
Blogger jm said...

Joe I thought your SO had it.

Enthusiasm is the item in short supply these days. I recall 35 years ago watching a film (Marshall McLuhan?) on how we all would be living a life of leisure by this date.

I remember too. We had a lot of hope as well.

it's what's lying in the shadows, and the bushes that trips us up.

You know it.

the path does not take us where we think we are headed

Maybe that's a good thing.

21/2/07 10:02 PM  
Anonymous Joe said...

Learning disability and dyslexia is what you were thinking of, jm. :o)

22/2/07 4:36 AM  

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